bealerDSB - 27 June 2009 09:16 PM
heath1974 - 27 June 2009 08:47 PM
Ultimately I suppose it depends on your reason to purchase…
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Having said that an old property restored to a modern and or sympathetic finish is what I feel it’s all about.
Best of both eras..
In that case then, it’s definately very important that when looking at older properties, with scope to modernise, you tread especially carefully. Obviously I have some experience working with older properties, reformed to both retain original charactaristics and charm, whilst also catering for modern requirements.
You may already have some experience with older properties, I don’t know, but one of the biggest problems I encounter is that not enough people seek independant professional advice before they buy. It’s always worth taking the time to weigh up the scale of any potential reform property purchase, as it’s quite easy for something to become a money pit. It’s also very common that most people I see have little or no experience of reforming or modernising a property in the UK, let alone here in Spain, with some of the shall we say, “unique” aspects of their construction. With that in mind, it’s definately worth while calling in a professional to take a look at a property before making a decision to buy. Anyone worth their salt will advise what’s possible and what’s not, provide realistic estimates for any work you think you would do, plus advise what “permisso’s” are required, such as if the work would be classed as “major” or “minor”, with an idea of their costs too.
For example, there’s many times that I’ve been asked to look at replacing a roof. Sometimes the construction beneath is structurally sound and will take a modern roof construction without much trouble. Other times we find that upper supporting walls aren’t much else than pebbles and mud, with a little straw thrown in for good measure, fine for supporting a timber beam and chapa roof, but will clearly not support a concrete beam and pod roof construction. It’s often the case when this is found, that the entire upper storey needs rebuilding, before a new roof can be built, or alternative roofing methods have to be designed.
Other times, there’s houses which are structurally sound overall and will remain so for many more years, so long as they’re not disturbed structurally and most of the work is simply modernising services and cosmetic finishing.
Overall I tend to suggest it’s worth having an overall budget in mind that incorporates the purchase, all the fees and any reform work, then stick to it. Although there can obviously be some unforeseen problems when work is undertaken, anyone with experience should factor such things into any initial estimates they provide. I personally always try to estimate on a “worst case” scenario basis for any work on older properties. This means that in most cases, when work is finished, the costs are less than the “worst case” scenario, whilst also never more. I much prefer to take this approach than the “quote cheap to get the job, then hit the client with the extras” method I’ve come up against too many times.
As for older property prices, it tends to be a mixed bag. There are inevitably some bargains to be had buying from expats who need to sell quickly, have had all or most of the reform work done already, but will also listen to offers. I’ve been keeping an eye on a few properties on the internet and it’s interesting to see how they’ve dropped in price over the last several months. Unfortunately for them, they might be making a loss on their overall outlay, but without sounding too synical, one person’s loss is always usually another’s gain.
I tend to find that as mentioned in this thread by a couple of others, the Spanish tend to stick to their guns a lot of the time for the asking price, though I once helped a neighbour in a village I lived in a couple of years ago, get the asking price down on a property from ?80k to ?55k. We basically took the vendor to the local bar, sat and had a good chat with them, got to know them, they the potential buyer and haggled. The vendor was prepared to negotiate, but only in very small “drops” in price at first. In the end we said that we were aware the property had been empty and for sale for “years” and offered ?55k “take it or leave it” as it was to be a cash purchase, no mortgage or finance involved. Empty house in need of work that’s costing you money, or money in the bank?. They accepted the offer the following day, the deal was done and purchase completed within two weeks. So again, it is possible, without agents (do have a good bi-lingual abogado ready though!), if you’re prepared to explore locations and make contact with the locals.
Fortunately, the “econimic crisis” has had one posative effect… many of the cowboys are gone. Still, always get plenty of references, see examples of previous projects, before contracting anyone. If dealing with agents, always use your own abogado and tradesmen, rather than ones they might recommend. There’s still this thing for back-hand deals going on. I had an agent contact me recently who suggested they would be more than happy to recommend his clients to me in return for a 20% cut of all the work. I told him I wasn’t interested, as our business likes to remain independant and impartial, with the exception of any suppliers or sub-contractors we use and can highly recommend. What he wanted me to do was basically lie to people he was trying to sell properties to, that everything was “fine” and only minimal work was required. No thanks!
There’s also a few people here in this forum who’ve had both posative, mixed, or negative experiences when it comes to buying older houses, having considerable work done on their properties. I’m sure they’ll all be happy to share their thoughts.
