I’m in an interesting situation here but I think there should be others in the same shoes.
Let me write in bullet points so it’s clearer:
- Background
1. I’m a non-EU country citizen and I’d like to live in Spain for a year or so.
2. I have sufficient income from a business in my home country to support my living in Spain. In other words, I don’t need and don’t want to find a job in Spain.
3. My yearly income is not sufficient enough for me to qualify for the non-lucrative visa ($75,000/year as indicated here)
- Question
1. Can someone suggest a good solution for me to just get a visa (and the residency card, I assume) to stay in Spain for a year without looking for a job? I don’t know which visa would work out for me.
2. Can someone explain what it would take to get a visa for self-employed as shown here:
I don’t understand the explanation especially “This document must be submitted at this Consulate General…”
3. A “solution” I’ve thought of is to first get a job/contract in Spain from a friend who owns a company in Spain so that I can get a work permit and a visa to enter spain… But the problem is… I’d then have to pay tax. So my sub-questions are:
(3a) Is there a threshhold of salary under which neither this employer (my friend) nor I need to pay social security stuff/tax? Frankly speaking, I don’t feel comfortable paying tax for a “phantom salary”.
(3b) If I break the contract after I arrive in Spain (so as to terminate the work and avoid tax), I’d become jobless. Will my visa be revoked? Or if I wait till I get my residency card and break the contract will my residency card be revoked?
Thanks in advance for answering my questions!
Owen
Copy of the Work Authorization Application (Solicitud de Permiso de Trabajo) filed with the Ministry of Labor in Spain and one photocopy. This document must be submitted at this Consulate General within thirty (30) days from the date stamped by the Ministry of Labor in Spain.
That’s the part in question you mean, right?
So you come to Spain with a foreign source of income, set yourself up as autonomo and your company in wherever pays you as an independent contractor in Spain. Yep, it’s hard to get around paying the social security, but hey, it’ll be around $250 per month, and that’s not bad for the chance to live in Spain without qualifying for any other visa. Trust me, if I were in your situation and knowing how tough it can be to get your paperwork in order in this country that’s what I’d do.
Of course having your friend “hire” you is a very similar option, again you’ll have to pay the social security, etc. It might be more difficult however, as the work permit takes time to process and you’d have to return home to pick up the visa in your passport.
They’re not immigration lawyers, but they can set you up with a business anyway. Try http://www.strongabogados.com . They may or may not take you on as a client since your issue falls into the shadier side of corporate law, but it’s a good place to start. Normally it’s between 1200-1700? for setting up the company and visa, etc., at least last time I checked.
Do you happen to know the answer to my 3rd question?
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3. A ?solution? I?ve thought of is to first get a job/contract in Spain from a friend who owns a company in Spain so that I can get a work permit and a visa to enter spain? But the problem is? I?d then have to pay tax. So my sub-questions are:
(3a) Is there a threshhold of salary under which neither this employer (my friend) nor I need to pay social security stuff/tax? Frankly speaking, I don?t feel comfortable paying tax for a ?phantom salary?.
(3b) If I break the contract after I arrive in Spain (so as to terminate the work and avoid tax), I?d become jobless. Will my visa be revoked? Or if I wait till I get my residency card and break the contract will my residency card be revoked?
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I’ll only travel to Spain as early as October this year so I can ask my friend to apply for my work permit in Spain right now. He lives in a small city… Do you think it’s faster to be processed than large cities like Madrid? I heard it’ll take 1-3 months or longer in order to obtain the work permit… Is that true?
I guess the problem with autonomo is that it’s considerably more troublesome and costs more (since I’d be paying the same or more tax PLUS setting up cost).
The best solution, if they don’t take my visa/residency card back is to have my friend hire me and later break the contract, right?
Hey Owen… maybe this solution is too simplistic for your situation… but as someone who lived in Spain for 2 years, I found the solution to be this simple: go to London for a weekend every 3 months or so. You only need a visa for a stay longer than 3 months, and flying in and out of England (which is EXTREMELY cheap I might add) will get you that blessed passport stamp… plus England is so much fun, what’s not to love? 😊 I never had a visa and never once had any trouble, as I traveled to England frequently enough. I went a five month stretch once without traveling, and still- no hassle at the airport. And yes, this was post 9/11…
If I’m not wrong, you are from one of the countries whose citizens don’t need to apply for a visa in order to travel to Spain.
Sadly, even as a tourist, I need to apply for a visa. So the equivalent solution for me is to return to my home country and apply for a tourist visa every 3 months, which is both troublesome and expensive.
Hey Owen… maybe this solution is too simplistic for your situation… but as someone who lived in Spain for 2 years, I found the solution to be this simple: go to London for a weekend every 3 months or so. You only need a visa for a stay longer than 3 months, and flying in and out of England (which is EXTREMELY cheap I might add) will get you that blessed passport stamp… plus England is so much fun, what’s not to love? 😊 I never had a visa and never once had any trouble, as I traveled to England frequently enough. I went a five month stretch once without traveling, and still- no hassle at the airport. And yes, this was post 9/11…
Where are you from Mandy? I’m guessing American?
Indeed you have a good point, and a few I’d dispute - that being that English is fun and is cheap to travel to - don’t forget the cost of that damn Stansted Express, tube tickets, taxis, etc etc, everything is damn expensive and I can’t really stand London for more than a couple days. IMHO
Technically you were still overstaying your visa during those two years Mandy. You’re only allowed 180 days of every year within the Schengen limits, just like Canadians in the US. That being said, I didn’t exactly adhere to those limitations myself and hopped around France, Italy and went home a couple times without ever sorting my visa situation out as well as I should have, and certainly without any issues.
As for your #3, briefly: I’m not sure. I haven’t confirmed the work visa sitch, but I believe that you’d be okay after quitting your “job”. As for your minimum taxable income (or allowance as one might call it), check out our page on taxes. Sorry the news isn’t for positive. :(
“You need to stop thinking like an American”. That is what a lawyer of one of Spain’s most prestigious law firms told me when I was asking the same quetions. By nature as Americans, we want to do everything by the book. He actually advised that I not even worry about applying for any kind of visa at all (as did several other laywers from top firms in Barcelona)! The Spanish administration does NOT keep tabs on how long you’ve been in the country. Heck, half the time they don’t even stamp your passport! I know LOTS non-EU citizens that have lived here for many years without any problems. If you are an American, perhaps you can feel rest assured by the fact that an American has NEVER been deported from Spain…
I myself originally wanted to apply for a self-employment visa. The cost of the entire process is ridiculous for something that you are not even guaranteed to get. After spending upwards of 10k euros, the Spanish administration can simply deny your request, even if you meet all of the qualifications. I have a friend who has an international business that is doing extremely well. He applied for the self-employment visa about 1.5 years ago and still had it rejected.
You can apply for the non-lucrative visa too (as I have - I have an American based business that generates all of my income). It’s also not guaranteed that you will be granted a non-lucrative visa (again, even if you meet the qualifications).. My attourney advised me that non-EU citizens who meet the qualifications stand about a 70% to 80% chance of being granted the non-lucrative visa. I applied for it because I’d like to eventually raise a family in Spain. Once you are granted the visa (lasts for 1 year), getting it renewed is pretty easy. After 5 years, you are officially a permanent resident of the EU. So I’m keeping my fingers crossed.
Hey, I agree if if you are only staying for one year, just don’t worry about. Unless you are planning on running into legal problems, you will probably not once have any need to deal with police or immigration officials. Like Mandy, I am American so I didn’t need a visa to enter. In your case, get the visa and then forget about it. You will not be stopped or fined on your way out, after all you will be leaving. One year is not worth all the hassle you are facing. As the last poster expressed finely, even if you do everything right, you can still be rejected. Then again, doing everything wrong (ie. staying here under the radar) will save you the time and hassle.
And a note to Mandy and others who think flying to England is a good idea….it is not! First of all, as the Expatriator pointed out, the law is you can’t exceed 3 months in any 6 month period. So just bopping out the country doesn’t beat the law. Second, the cheapie airlines are you worst choice. I had to go to England twice in the last two years (I’ve been in Spain illegally four years now) and both times took cheapie flights. And both times was nearly prevented from leaving England. After the second time this happened I was curious, so I looked into it. Basically, all major airlines have insurance (funds) to repatriate someone should the place of destination refuse them. So, if I was on United Airlines and got refused at Barajas, United would be obligated to take me back to the US. But they have funds to cover this so it is not such a big issue. On the other hand, the cheapie airlines, Easy Jet, Argentinia Air, etc, do not have this funding, so they tend to be very, very careful with whom they let on their flights as they don’t have the funding to fly that person back. The first time it happened was two years ago so I don’t remember all the details, but the last time was in January. Basically, the check-in person in London started hitting me with questions….why are you in Spain, what are you doing there, do you have a visa, etc. Then she called her supervisor and he started with more questions. Because I am illegal, I usually travel with as few documents that indicate I live in Spain as possible (no bank card, no metro pass). BUT, in this case, they wanted PROOF I lived here. Finally, in the bottom of my wallet, I found my Sanitas (health insurance) card and that satisfied them. Of course, the whole incident terrified me and I was so scared that Immigration at Barajas wouldn’t let me in, but….they didn’t even glance at my passport, just stamped me right through.
So….morale of the story….don’t think flying to England will save you….one, it doesn’t meet the visa requirements and two, the cheaper the airline, the more trouble you’ll have returning.
And for Owen’s situation, for only one year, just don’t worry about it.
Would ask that you please check your facts on one important issue that is circulating in this e-mail thread. I do not believe there is a set sum of income (or savings) required for Residencia non-Lucrativa. By definition, this type of visa is subjective—the authorities can grant it or not as they wish, because there is not a fixed financial requirement. They are looking for a sufficient sum, but that will be significantly less than $75,000 per year. I have heard of targets more on the order of ?10,000 per person per year—which would be more in line with Spanish cost of living.
The confusion may come from the desire of authorities to see bank accounts with a balance of $75,000, as back-up to a pension or other income. But an annual income of $75,000 would make someone one of the highest wage earners living in Spain and is almost certainly incorrect. Would you be able to clarify this with your sources at New York consultate? It is a vital question. Thanks.
Hi Prisant,
I checked it this morning and it would appear the NY Consulate has a new website (thank God! The old one was pretty horrid). On the new site they have NO no non-lucrative visa listed anymore! I’m not sure what that means. Since I have no “contact” there with them I think I’ll just send them an email. If anyone else has some info on that then that would be helpful.
I don’t think the $75k per year was so out of question however, Spain has every reason to ask a foreigner to ensure they have greater available means than their own citizens. And the $75k was directly taken from the old NY Consulate website.
Some months ago teknosmoker wrote “If you are an American, perhaps you can feel rest assured by the fact that an American has NEVER been deported from Spain?”
Where did you get this information? I just spoke with the US Consulate in Fuengirola and they claim that American’s are definitely deported from Spain.
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